“Minor 2nd, 6th & 7th Intervals” – INCORRECT MUSIC THEORY – BEWARE!!

PLEASE EXPLAIN to me how a Minor 2nd, Minor 6th or Minor 7th or Minor 5th is correct music theory when it's INCORRECT MUSIC TEACHING?

 

PLEASE POST YOUR VIDEO RESPONSE!!  I will share and promote your response.

 

I'll post my answer after I have 3 to 5 video explanations.  

 

 

(MY ANSWER to the explanation given by the Theorist below is POSTED HERE)

Response #1 From THEORIST:

Minor 2nds, 6ths and 7ths are based on how the 3rd moves. For example, C and E is a major third. When you flat the E, it becomes E flat therefore the major third becomes a minor third. It's more about the concept of intervals and the quality of the intervals. The same thing applies to the 2nds, 6ths and 7ths. It's more about the move a half step down. 4ths and 5ths are different because they are the purest intervals meaning that they have an open quality to them. Because of their pure qualities they are called perfect intervals. They cannot be made minor or major. They can be raised a half step becoming augmented or lowered a half step becoming diminished. The premise is that it's about the intervals and the quality of each specific interval.

By the way this concept makes more sense when you read music.

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

Thanks for your explanation, You are the first to give one. hmmm, I do see some inconsistencies with this traditional theory, but I'll address it in my video to support my thoughts. Thanks again for taking the time to respond... God Bless

 

Response #2 From THEORIST

Robert - No problem at all! I'm always willing to help a fellow musician. If you have any other questions at all, feel free to let me know! Peace and God bless as well!

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

Theorist, you are aware that I do disagree with your explanation right? To me, when something is Flattened that is usually equal to one semitone lower. A flattened 3rd or 4th is still a distance of one semitone, why the change in name and function? (ie. Minor or Diminished?) I'll be covering more in my video...I know they teach it this way Theorist, but is it really correct?

 

Response #3 From THEORIST

Robert - You are correct in that flattening a note is equal to a semitone (half-step) lower. The only way this will make sense is if you read music. For example, if you hear an A flat, you can say it's A flat or G sharp. The only way you would know what it is is if you read it in a musical context. Knowing what sharps and flats belong to whatever key would clear that up. When it comes to the interval of a 4th, it's called a perfect interval due to it pure quality. Perfect intervals (4ths, 5ths and octaves) can only be diminished or augmented. I understand that if you diminish a perfect 4th, (C and F and you flatten the F to E, for example), audibly, you will hear a major 3rd, which is correct however you have to look at it in context in musical notation. Hence reading will make this clearer. Mind you I am not dismissing the fact that some things in music can be ambiguous. Written music, knowing your key signatures and the Circle Of Fifths (or Fourths) makes a big difference in understanding this.

Just to add, minor, diminished etc is used to describe the interval. The interval is the building block to music. Looking at the musical notation will bring this to light.

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

Thanks for your responses, but you are digging a hole for yourself, You're going to love my video with the explanation. Music principles should not contradict themselves. When you hear minor, it should mean minor. When you hear diminished it should mean diminished. According to what you're saying, a minor and diminished intervals are one semitone lower than a particular key (For ex. in the key of "C" = F to E or E to Eb). You may have to visit the theory on a Diminshed 7 chord, and check if it contains diminished intervals or minor intervals? (I'll cover that in another post)

 

Response #4 From THEORIST

Robert - I beg to differ. If you know how to read music, theory will make more sense. You also have to know the qualities of the intervals as well. Diminished is only used on perfect intervals (4ths, 5ths and octaves). I don't know if you can read or not but musical notation will make this clearer. I am not disagreeing about hearing intervals like C to E which is a major 3rd, however the key is when you look at musical notation, it could written as C and F flat because of the musical context. Here is a grammatical example. If I say the word building, that specific word can be interpreted in different ways as a verb or a noun. When I put the word building in a sentence like "I am building a house." the word building has a specific meaning in this case being a verb. It's all about context when in comes to music. If you don't know the fundamentals (reading, key signatures etc), then it won't make sense. I guess it's agree to disagree...*shrugs* No worries on the grammar! It's all good!

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

It's definitely all good Theorist,.. In terms of reading music, I haven't been in-doctrinated with that teaching and theory,.Hence I am able to see the things that are incorrect in their theory. My reading skills are maybe about a 2 out of 10, however my understanding of music is pretty good. You see the theme of that teaching is "Don't look down at the piano and try to understand the music , just keep your eyes on the sheet and do what it says, it's clearer on the sheet." That sounds like programming to me. You said that "Diminished is only used on perfect intervals (4th, 5th and octaves)", then maybe you can explain if the characteristic of a Diminshed is one semitone or two semitones?.... I look forward to hearing from you.

 

Response #5 From THEORIST

Robert - What you experienced in the lesson is what is done in sight reading. When you sight read, it's more about what you see with your eyes. You can't look down at the keys when doing this because you can lose your place when reading, especially when reading in a band setting. Sight reading is only done when you are looking at a piece for the first time. Sight reading and learning a piece of music are two different things. The first requires sight and it's more of a glance and surface thing. Learning a piece of music involves more internalization of the music. I will send you a picture to explain the diminished due to time constraints on my end.  Sorry if its not clear. It's from my iPad.

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

No prob..I understand.. In the meantime (I have posted your picture diagram you sent on my Any Key Music Page) and your diagram is exactly my point. The theory is inconsistent. Without all those added, made up and inconsistent rules of the Pharisees (traditional theory = 10 + 70 other Commandments)..lol.. people would be able to excel so much more in music without being confused... According to the diagram, when you go 1 semitone lower from the (Major 2,3,6,7) it's a "Minor" interval; and when you go one semitone lower from the (Perfect 1, 4, 5 and 8, because it's a pure quality) it's a Diminished interval. In my book, going down one semitone is simply that and nothing else. Let me reiterate my question again, is the characteristic of a Diminished one semitone or two semitones below a note?.. By the way can you play me a "Minor 7th chord"; then a "Minor 6th" then a "Minor 2nd" chord. Are you starting to see the inconsistencies now? Anyhow, this is my last message to you (I promise) until I give the proper explanation for these intervals...God Bless

 

Response #6 From THEORIST

Are you talking about a diminished triad, a diminished 7th chord or a diminished interval? Anyway just to make this easier, Charlie Parker said it best: "Learn theory...and then forget it". Lmbo....great talking with you Bro! Peace and God bless!!

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

Specifically I'm asking about a Diminished interval and a Diminished 7th chord (which by the way is also incorrect..lol..I did a video on that already). After you answer that, then my next question is, "What key would "Db" be the 7th Scale Degree in, and what would be the Diminished 7th interval of that key?

 

Response #7 From THEORIST

A diminished interval is created one of two ways: first from a perfect interval (4ths, 5ths and octaves) and secondly from a minor interval (minor 7th for example). The first set with the perfect intervals are straight forward where you take a perfect 5th (C and G) and bring the G down a half step to F# therefore becoming a diminished 5th, due the fact that Perfect intervals can only be made augmented or diminished. The second case has more steps. We will start with an interval of a major 7th C and B. To make it a minor 7th, you flat the B and it becomes C and Bflat. To make it diminished you flat the Bflat again and it becomes B double flat (there is a symbol for this) or better known as A. It's called B double flat because when you flat a minor interval it becomes diminished. Just keep in mind that the intervals are based on the major scale.

Now to the diminished chord. We take the concept of the major 7th, flattening the major 7th to a minor 7th and flattening the minor 7th to a diminished 7th. If you look at a C diminished 7th chord, it is made up of stacked minor thirds. For example, C, E Flat, G Flat and B double flat. It's spelled out this way because sharps and flats aren't supposed to mix (Classical theory). Each note that is spelled shows the relationship of a minor 3rd.

Now to the question about D flat being a 7th degree. If you check out the Circle of Fifths (or Fourths depending on which direction you are going), D flat isn't a 7th scale degree because it is actually C#. C# is the 7th scale degree in the key of D major. Keep in mind you have enharmonic tones meaning that one note can have 2 to 3 names depending on the musical circumstance. For example, C# and D flat sound and are the same note audibly however musical context differentiates the two. The diminished 7th in the key of D would be C flat (better known as B natural). C# is the major 7th, C natural is the minor 7th and C flat is the diminished 7th. Once again musical notation will clear this up.

 

ANY KEY MUSIC: ROBERT

...I know you know that I'm having fun with this, but I think you summed it up for everyone that will disagree with my point... And this is all the evidence I need..lol.. I'll post my video explanation next wee; Even though I would love to hear about two more opinions... Fyi, I do know the traditional theory out there, however I didn't want it to come from me, I wanted a proper explanation and representation from a third party who has been trained in it to speak. Thank you...( By the way a Diminished 7th chord is incorrect theory. When you have some time, check out my YouTube video "Errors in Music Theory - Dim7", The German composer that initially was debating with me, took down his responses after he saw that his argument had no weight. Enharmonics was his downfall..)

 

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